What to do about a “Bad Seed”? - Page 2

Sevan · #11 10-30-2006, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Esis

...and let loose the hounds of war!

Do the hounds of war come back on their own? Or do you have to buy new hounds of war every time you let them loose? Just wondering.

be0wulfe · #12 10-31-2006, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sevan

Do the hounds of war come back on their own? Or do you have to buy new hounds of war every time you let them loose? Just wondering.

And if they're French Poodles do they actually make a bee line for the goose liver pate in the rear echelon ... ?

TwisteD · #13 10-31-2006, 06:54 PM

Depends what the root of the problem is with this bad seed (pun not intended..wellll..actually...it was). It could be two or more people have character conflicts or some bad blood that you could easily settle by sitting in a Ventrilo or Team Speak server and talk out the problems like adults.

If things cant be worked out in a civil manner then kick them after giving this person(s) a fair chance.

peter · #14 12-19-2006, 02:31 PM

I believe I apped to section 1 when i was level 10 and got denied, so in turn I created my own guild and am running organized pvp along with thebalance. I hope to get more members from various guilds on board.

samhain · #15 12-19-2006, 05:41 PM

I have a new found respect for the leadership abilities of Hexed and Palos.

peter · #16 12-19-2006, 05:48 PM

running org pvp you mean?

Nine · #17 12-26-2006, 02:49 AM

Having a bad seed puts leadership in terrible positions. I wish I was quicker to pull the trigger to remove someone but fact is it can get difficult, once that seed roots you'll have issues. For the longetivity of a guild and its survival I think removing bad seeds is pretty important no matter the cost. It will usually hurt you more in the long run than it would if you made the move to get rid of them.

Bagheera · #18 12-28-2006, 07:39 PM

Be quick to boot, and quicker to forget.

Bad seeds grow to become bad apples, and a bad apple will taint the entire barrel in time.

If someone cant abide by guildrules, or positively contribute to the guild in their first week or so in it, dont expect them to change, and dont waste the time TRYING to change them. Simply kick them out and IF they show signs of change and wish to rejoin at a later date, reconsider them under their merits then.

Of course, the exact expectations depend on how a specific game implements guilds/clans, and what liabilities the guildmates are exposed to by having a new, potentially untested, member within the guild.

Xinnro · #19 12-31-2006, 04:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Esis

Good topic!

I think Sevan hit the nail on the head. Fire fast, hire slow. In any of the guilds I've lead (including non MMORPG games), I've always spent a ridiculous amount of time interviewing people and find it to be the most effective strategy in dealing with the bad apples, that is--the best way to deal with them is to never let them in. Often enough a simple conversation is sufficient to see what they're really interested in.

In SWG there was this one kid who desperately wanted to join--so I talked with him alot, and it was obvious that he was young and not well suited for the guild. So I did the acid test..mhwha, I said 'talk to me in exactly two weeks and if you still want to join, we'll talk again', and I encouraged him to group with as many S1 as possible. He did, and was surprisingly persistent--after two weeks, we talked, I said 'come back in one week'--surely that would work. Nope..a week later, on cue, there he was. Long story short, he followed all my suggestions, tried very hard, and ultimately was turned away.

The moral of the story? Sometimes your best just isn't good enough. mwha...just kiddding.

Ok! To address the real question--say someone got through the interview and turned out to be trouble--which has happened to me a handful of times, what to do!

I think rules need to be extremely clear upon entrance of the guild, I always had members memorize the 3 rules I had--fairly simple, and repeat them to me before entering. I also always explained the purpose of those rules and their importance to the guild, and so in the event of someone breaking them, I could skip the "well maybe you didn't read #3 very well..." conversation. I don't believe in the instant axe without some sort of due process,(which can be a 5 minute conversation), but certainly there are cases where someone needs to be booted immediately.

As far as dictatorship and democracy--I'm 100% for Republican Democracy! A federalism where the 'people' have very little power directly but those in power are in their position via merit and have the respect of the people, and so represent the 'peoples' nterests. I believe in a ruling body, not a monarchy, but that ruling body must remain fairly small. So while I support a monarch with peer advisors, I don't agree with a unilateral monarch. Viva la huelga! Si se puede!

Anyway! In summary-- best dealt with by initial screening, followed by extremely clear guild guidelines, and in the case of a violation, immediately talk to the person and let them know where they stand. In the event of a termination, barring clear cases, get a second opinion and let loose the hounds of war!

Esis

Couldn't of said it better myself.

Quality of quanity, as I always say.

Have an application to get into the guild, a voting process, and probation period. Doing this reduces the chances of getting a "bad seed". However, even if you do happen to get a bad seed, getting rid of them immediatley tends to get rid of the problem.

Varria · #20 01-01-2007, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow

maybe its because I have never a guild but you can't be quick to react, I mean people have the bad days, some people have bad weeks. An like any good relationship there misunderstandings and you can only grow if people tell you about your faults, so I agree you have to kill cancer as soon as it starts to grow, but you have to first identify that it is cancer and not just growing pains (that imagery was working so well and just didn't end right, I hope you can all get my drift).

I disagree with this....you CAN't bend rules just because someone is having a bad day. They know the rules up front...they know the consequences, therefore if they screw up and break the rules, then out they go, despite the circumstances. In this way other possible "persons of questionable morality and honor" will see that you mean business, and this may avert future problems.

I'm sorry but i have run many, many guilds and this IMO is the only way to deal with problems. If you can't keep your personal problems from coming out in your public gameplay, then you indeed have a problem that needs to be addressed by you yourself.

As far as faults, everyone has them. The good players will not act irrationally and cause mayhem in your ranks with them tho. This is why you HAVE to be very picky about who you accept and who ya dont. So i still stay with my opinion that if they are causing problems...out they go. Period.